Charlie Kirk, Jimmy Kimmel, and the Media's Role in Shaping Public Discourse

This is episode number 332 of The Homeowner Show. Well, whether you're DIY or looking to hire, we're here to help you find the best information and options for you and your home. My name is Kevin Hackett, and here with me is Craig Williams.

Hello, hello, hello, and welcome to The Homeowner Show. We're so glad that you could join us for another live episode here in the studio. How you doing, Kev?

Man, I'm doing good. It's, uh, you know, I feel like it's been a while again since I've been on.

Yeah.

It's just been a wild few weeks. But, uh, Kevin doesn't like to go out in the wild, y'all. Well, you know, sometimes things happen whenever I'm unavailable. Okay. Just happens to be what it happens.

to be.

But man, no, things are, things are pretty good. It like routine has set in again. And, uh, I don't know that I don't have any, I don't have any like positive, negative necessarily. Life's just good. How about you?

Man, it's, it's, it's been a crazy week or so.

Well, that's true for sure. But that, does that have anything to do with you personally or just life?

Uh, here's what I find Interesting. Okay. Is if you say nothing, how many people want to know your opinion? I've had a lot of people asking me my opinion.

Yeah. On a lot of stuff. Yeah.

Here lately. And I have been hesitant to give it.

Sure.

Not because I don't have one.

That's, well, you always have an opinion.

I always have an opinion.

I do too.

Man, I mean, like, we're gonna get into some of the Charlie Kirk stuff tonight.

Yeah.

We're gonna talk about it and some of the other stuff too, man. Like, I wanna talk about some of the late night TV stuff going on right now.

Oh yeah.

'Cause I think there's a lot of rigmarole and hullabaloo going on with that that's just not founded in much of anything.

Yeah.

But, you know, just, so we also wanna talk about rate cuts. We had some rate cuts.

Yes, we did.

So here's a rare opportunity for you, Kev.

Okay.

We can talk a little sports.

Oh, I like it.

Yeah.

I'm all in.

So, I mean, you went to a game last night.

Well, I went to a game 2 nights ago.

2 nights ago.

It was actually 3 nights ago now.

Yeah.

But then I went to a game 2 nights before that as well that had some crazy stuff going on.

Was that the Tech game?

Yeah.

Did they— oh, they won that one.

They did. It was, I mean, they were playing, you know, Oregon State, who was, you know, 0-2. Uh, the Beavers? Yes, they're the Beavers. And, uh, we got 7 plays in including the opening kickoff, and there was a 2.5-hour weather delay.

Oh gosh.

And, uh, one thing that was—

Is that what happened with your flight?

Well, see, I didn't fly because one of the crazy things, it just lived, you know, Lubbock in general is, I mean, there's no flights after like 5 or 6.

Right.

And, you know, we needed to get out either late that night or early the next morning.

Uh-huh.

And the first flights were at like 8 or something like that. So we couldn't get back to where we needed to be in time. So we drove. See, here's the thing. I don't mind driving. It's not a big deal. I do.

Yeah. I don't want to.

I mean, it's fine. I don't mind.

I'll do it, but I don't want to.

Yeah, well, I wanted to fly, but I just had no options. Well, the game started at 2:30.

Mmhmm.

Well, even a long NCAA football game, which lasts longer than it should... Okay, we're done by what, 6?

Should be.

6-ish?

Yeah, they're typically about 4 hours long. Yeah.

And so, uh, well, the— we would've been home probably by 2 o'clock in the morning, and I was kind of okay with that.

Mmhmm.

Um, well, the game didn't start till 5:15. After the weather delay.

After the weather delay. Was there lightning? Is that what was going on?

Yeah, it was lightning.

OK. Yeah.

And, uh, dude, I think it rained more in Lubbock that day than it's rained in the last 3 years. Uh, it just doesn't rain in West Texas, but they've had a lot of rain this year. But, um, man, we, we just went to my parents' house.

Oh, did you really?

They live like 50 minutes away. And so, yeah, we—

I'm sure they were happy with that.

Well, sure. We stayed with them on the way in. Um, and, but my dad wasn't there. He was coming in from, uh, overseas. He had a mission trip he was on.

Oh, he was doing like a preaching school or something like that, wasn't he?

Yeah, he was in Trinidad. So he was coming in on Saturday. And so anyway, we were gonna miss him. Well, it wound up that we got to spend the night there again.

That's good.

Yeah, no, it worked out. It was fine. And thankfully there was no issues the next day or anything. But, um, so that was, that was a long weekend.

Right.

And then we, um, Then we got tickets to the Rangers game on Monday. Yeah. And yeah, they just wound up late.

Do you think they have any chance of catching at this point?

Look, look here. Here's— I don't think they had any chance of catching before. Mm-hmm. What happened was a bit bizarre.

See, what happened was.

Yeah, because see, what had happened was Uh, so... a bunch of their players— of our players, the Rangers players, got hurt.

Mmhmm.

I mean, the big stars, the big money on our team, Yeah. all got hurt at the same time, which is just bizarre. Like, Corey Seager got appendicitis, man.

Oh, jeez.

Of all the things. It had nothing to do with baseball.

Yeah.

Um, and so, you know... It was just what it was. Well, we had these young kids come up from AAA. They'd all been playing together in AAA for 2 years now, and they were kind of going, well, this is fun. We've been playing with each other down there. We'll play with each other up here. And they swept the Brewers, the best team in baseball. They won 2 out of 3 in New York with the Mets.

Mm-hmm.

Uh, also one of the best teams in baseball right now. Um, and which feels weird to say, which feels weird to say, but they, so they went on this pretty impressive run and everyone's like, oh, look, they're going to do it. And I'm like, how? Like they don't have, they don't have the track record this year. They've been terrible all year. And yeah, they won some games. That's not sustainable. Um, and they come into Houston and man, like I hear there's a couple of things that I think are just true.

Mm-hmm.

Number one, bunch of injuries that plagues you. Next, you come into a pretty big rivalry and you got people booing you and you got like this big stage and like this, there's all this emotion that's happening beyond baseball itself.

Right.

And like trying to, like all the pressure that baseball brings in and of itself. And I just don't think they had it in them. So. And I don't know, maybe, uh, the Astros had a little help with their pitch selections.

I, I didn't watch the game. I just look for the scores and whether or not I can taunt you.

No, that's fine. Like, honestly, I mean, really, I've, I've had— May was terrible, June was terrible, July was terrible, August was okay, beginning of September was, it was pretty good. And, uh, yeah, I, I don't know. It's weird. So here's, here's what I do believe.

Yeah.

I do believe that whoever wins the West will— that should be their victory because that will be— I don't think anybody's gonna progress very far, whether it's the Mariners or the Astros or if the, you know, by some chance of luck, the Rangers wind up in the wild card somehow. They're all going to fail miserably. They don't have— they're— they are the worst division in baseball. Oh, really?

Oh, yeah. By far.

So it's pretty bad. Like, I will put it this way. Whoever wins the West would probably be 3rd place in almost every other division. Yeah.

So there you go.

Yeah. Tells you something.

All right. I kind of feel— I kind of feel that way about TU right now.

Oh yeah, dude, that's—

I was singing this song last year with these guys.

Well, so here's the, here's the thing. I, I am going on record to say that I think Arch Manning is injured.

You think he's injured?

I think he's injured. Yeah, because I've seen him play before. He's only played a few downs here or there, you know, last year, but the guy's throwing motion is all out of whack. I mean, he's throwing sidearmed. He's— it's like weird stuff is happening. And I'm like, there's no way that that is natural, you know?

Surely if he's injured, like, they've got somebody that can at least manage the game.

Oh, I would think so.

Better than like—

Put them in.

Sure. I mean, like, 3 interceptions now.

Oh, it's bad.

So I mean, like, I— and I've heard some people talking about it, but like Again, I—

you think they're overhyped?

100%.

But Texas A&M isn't?

Huh?

Texas A&M isn't overhyped? Right now? Uh-huh.

No.

Okay.

No, I don't think they're overhyped.

Okay.

I think— no, I think they were— I, I think— I mean, like, where they're at right now, probably a little bit.

Okay.

Probably a little bit. Um, but as— but like, there's just— here's the problem is there's so many unknowns with the way that they've allowed the league to become. where the transfer portal and paying the players. Like, here's the thing, a lot of people don't realize, I mean, like, when you made it available for them to pay players and the transfer portal was immediate, A&M's going to win. They've got more money than just about anybody.

Well, that's true, but they didn't win this year.

What do you mean?

Texas Tech was by far the highest portal spending team. Maybe.

They—

no, not maybe. They spent $25 million, which was almost, almost like 50% more than the closest person next to him. Yeah, it's crazy.

Well, it's— and it's, it's no disrespect to Texas Tech. I mean, they can spend all the money they want. They just don't have the brand.

No, they def— they definitely don't have the brand, except it will be interesting because, I mean, if they win the number of 5-star recruits they've been getting over the last few months because of every, all this portal stuff that's happened. It is interesting. And it's all because of Cody Campbell. And most people don't have a clue who Cody Campbell is. Well, let me tell you real quick. Cody Campbell graduated from Texas Tech. He played football at Texas Tech. He just sold, uh, last, I think it was either the beginning of this year or the end of last year. He just sold a business for $4 billion. And he is single-handedly funding all of this.

Oh, really?

Yes.

Oh, he's funding Texas Tech? Oh, yeah.

Okay. His name's on the football field.

Sure.

Like, the guy— I mean, he's just— they've now got the money because this guy's going— I mean, last year, whenever they were supposed to be better than they wound up being, uh, there was a tweet that went out by this kid. I don't know who he was. And, um, uh, he— I don't think he either— he knew who he was talking to, but he was like, you got some pretty big cojones here.

Right.

Cody Campbell said something about, you know, the refs are, are, you know, I normally don't say this, but the refs have been really against us. And this kid tweeted back to him and said, then buy us an O-line. And he, he tweeted back, I will. And he did. So it'll be real interesting. If they don't win the Big 12 this year, it'll be pretty sad, honestly.

So I, I think I'm not, I'm not, so like, obviously I went to A&M, so like, I'm, I'm, I'm express my bias. Yeah. But that being said, you now have an 0-2 Notre Dame.

Oh yeah.

That's still in the top 25.

Oh, I know. So, and it, it, it, I hate them.

Fair, fair enough. So, but like, here's a team that just last year was in the national championship game.

Yep.

And I don't know if that's what's holding them up in the top 25 or if there's just so much—

They've got strength of schedule on their side, but I mean, they have, because they're not in a conference, they have to wind up— They gotta run the table at this point. They have to.

Yeah. It's where they're at. But like, this comes back around to my problem with Texas is like they have a chump schedule. Again.

Mm-hmm.

Like, and I, I'm— look, I'm not like full-blown conspiracy theorist, but like, I fully believe like the SEC like gave them just like a golden ticket to come into the SEC.

Well, they did.

Like, look, we're gonna give you 2 to 4 years of like just easy schedule. Like, it won't even be that hard. By the way, Nick Saban's stepping down, so you're not even gonna have to worry about that anymore. I mean, it's like all this, all this stuff that just lines up for them. Not only that, and like preseason number 1. Why? I don't know, other than just like the hype around Arch Manning, who just turned out to be a dud.

So, so far I saw— by the way, I saw this really— you know how, how Peyton and Eli do like their, their side-by-side stuff?

Yeah. He—

and I guarantee this was AI generated, but they showed a clip of Arch just absolutely sucking, and, and, and Eli's going, see, see what he did there? He did this. And Peyton goes, That guy's not my nephew. I guarantee it was AI, but it's like, he's not my nephew.

That's not my nephew. Yeah.

So funny.

Dude, it was like in the— so like this last game where they're playing, who are they? UTSA? Was that who they were playing?

No, they were playing UTEP.

UTEP. That's who it was. They're playing UTEP and he has 10 incompletions in a row.

I know.

One of which was an interception.

Yeah.

It's like, yeah, can we, can we just pump the brakes on like whether, like it's, I know. And like, look, he seems like a nice kid.

No. Yeah.

Like I don't have like, my beef is just with this, just this ridiculous Texas hype.

Well, he's a Manning. I mean, look, he's got that.

Like all, all the, the, the, the pieces are on the board.

Yeah.

But like you still can't like deliver.

No, I, that's why I think honestly. I, I've seen him throw the ball.

I know you think he's hurt, but what if he's not?

Well, then he's just—

Because it's a strong possibility he's not.

Then he's got really bad coaches.

Well, he's got really bad coaches if he is hurt.

Sure. I don't disagree with that.

Either way, he's got bad coaches.

I don't disagree with that. But what I am saying is that what I've seen from him in the past, even when he was in high school, he didn't throw the ball like this.

Right.

Like, I don't know. He's not Brett Favre.

Well, I mean, you know, but that, that's how Brett Favre threw the ball. I, I kind of wonder if it's part— if it's like a psychological thing, because like he, he was only really brought in as like a running package quarterback last year. Yeah. You know, and I'm wondering—

Up until now.

Yeah. And I'm wondering if he thought like, well, I really need to change some stuff in order— I don't know, you know, because that, that can mess with you.

Sure.

So But I, I am curious as to whether or not Marcel Reed is the real deal.

Yeah.

I mean, he looks, he might be, he looks like it. He might be like, and like his, his passing percentage right now is not great.

Right.

But when you look at the numbers that he's getting on his passes, sure. Nuts.

Yeah.

I mean, like all of, I mean, like it's, it, it's crazy, man.

It'll, it'll be interesting to see.

I mean, they, and I think, I honestly, I do think a lot of that has to do with these 2 receivers that they have.

Yeah. I mean, having good receivers makes a huge difference, but you still have to be like— the NCAA has become the minor league football, like NFL football.

Yeah.

Because, because of the, all the portal stuff, which by the way, have you seen the change?

No.

So they just like last week, I think it was, they just changed, uh, the ruling on when you can enter the transfer portal. There's now only one time when you can, like one small window when you can enter the portal.

Mm-hmm.

Um, and so basically there is no spring transfer portal window for the NCAA anymore, uh, not for football. Um, so now players have, they have one single opportunity to enter the transfer portal and it's in January.

Oh.

That's the only time they can do it. So that just happened. And so it's going to change how things happen.

Oh yeah.

Thankfully, I mean, we've been, we've been saying it for a couple of years now, like, this is ruining football. And so hopefully that's going to make some changes. But I mean, I don't remember who it was, but it was some Aggie that said something to the effect of, we should never have someone on the offensive line that isn't a senior. I mean, because A&M has, like you said, so much money. They've got a brand. And, and when you can just buy your players, why would you ever have a starter that wasn't a senior? The largest, the fastest, the most mature, like all of those things. Like, you can just buy your team now.

Sure.

And so it's minor league NFL.

Yeah.

You know, football farm league, whatever you want to call it. And I'm, you know, you just have to know that that's what it is going in.

Yeah.

You know, and be okay with it or not.

Yeah. So I'm interested to see what happens. I don't know. I don't know that they're going to win the SEC. I think they have a good shot of making the playoffs.

Well, I mean, some of the big players aren't the same as they used to be. You know, you know, you don't have the Alabama, you know, I think not as big of a factor. No, I think Georgia's down. It's just, it's interesting. I will say that some other changes with all of these teams, like we're almost at the place where we've got these super conferences now.

Yeah.

We're basically there. I think it changes a lot. It'll be interesting.

Like the teams that I'm worried about aren't even in the SEC right now.

Oh, well, yeah.

I mean, I'm more worried about Miami.

Right.

I'm more worried about Florida State.

Sure.

I'm more worried about Ohio.

Uh-huh.

I think even Oregon, I think, is in the conversation.

Well, yeah.

I mean, it like, you know, and I think the SEC better just like watch themselves.

Oh no, you're not wrong. And I, I, I'm just here to tell you, like, watch out. Well, this week, Saturday will be a very telltale thing with Texas Tech 'cause they go to Utah. They're playing in Utah. I think, I think the Utes are, underrated right now.

Mm-hmm.

And they're, they're already ranked pretty high. So, um, it'll be, it'll be it. I mean, if Tech comes in there and, and, you know, steamrolls, watch out. If they get steamrolled, okay, we'll have that conversation. Right now they've only played like junior high teams.

Right.

Um, which I don't understand. I just don't understand why we're— I, I know why they do it because Uh, you know, you win 6 games, you get a bowl, automatic bid to a bowl, right? So you, you buy your, your wins. Yeah.

I get that.

I hate it.

It's stupid.

Change the rule on bowls. Like, you have to have 6 wins against, I don't know, FCS teams or something like, like, or FBS teams. I mean, like, like, like non-FCS teams is what I meant to say. I don't know. But what I do know is that, uh, football's changing, man.

It's gonna be weird. It's interesting.

Yeah.

So yeah, for sure. I'm not buying, I'm not buying all the hype, but I'm, I'm, dude, the, the 41-40 win was just— oh, did you watch it?

No.

It was nuts.

No, I wasn't, I wasn't able to watch it, but yeah.

The craziest, the craziest thing was the 86-yard touchdown pass where The, I think it was Mario Craver is the name of the receiver.

Yeah.

Um, which he, I think he's led in reception yards like 3 weeks in a row or something like that.

Wow.

Over 100 yards every game.

Nice.

Um, like he, uh, he runs into 3 dudes simultaneously.

What?

And just after catching the ball, spins out of it and then takes it like another 30 yards for the TD.

Wow.

It's a crazy play, man. And like, it wasn't like the only play. And the only reason Notre Dame lost that game is because they fumbled the field goal.

Yeah. That's it.

That's the only reason they lost that game.

I heard about it. I'm like, insane.

I mean, like, at the end of the day, I mean, it was, it was, it was pretty clear A&M just wanted it more.

Sure.

I mean, that was, that was what— and like, so that, that makes me—

And at Notre Dame.

That was the thing. It was, it was an on-the-road top 10 defeat.

It's huge.

That hasn't happened since the '90s for the Ags.

No, it's huge.

So it was, it was a big, it was a big moment. So I hope that, I hope they ride it right. I think Elko's the right guy to do it.

Yeah. Um, I mean, it may be now or never, man.

Like, so pretty, who knows?

Pretty interesting place. We'll see. Yeah.

But, um, so we've got all this other, I mean, like, you know, we, we gotta talk a little bit about Charlie Kirk assassination.

Yep.

'Cause that's, we do, just been dominating the news.

Well, I mean, this, this was such a, Massive, massive murder. And it— I don't even consider it a murder as much as I consider it an assassination.

That's what it was.

And I think everybody would consider that. But the moment it happened, I was like, he was assassinated. Like, that's— this was—

You, you saw the video of it, right?

Oh yes, I did.

Here's the problem. Like, not, not the problem. I— so I got the news that he got shot, and almost immediately after that, somebody sent me the footage.

Mhm.

of, of the, of the shooting. Right. And as soon as I saw it, I was like, he died right there. He died right there.

Right. That's what I said immediately. You do not, you do not recover from that.

No.

And I don't mean, I don't mean recover as in like you might get better. I don't mean recover as in you might be a vegetable someday. I mean, he died right then.

Yeah.

He, he lost, he lost enough blood in that moment He— when they moved him, yeah, he was gone.

I mean, I, I agree with you. I heard some guys that were close to him in his organization that were getting updates as it was going down, and they were saying they still had a pulse as they got to the hospital. I don't know how. I don't know how.

I don't either.

Um, so, but like, just the, the only appropriate response to this is tragic and sad. Unfortunately, that was not the response of a lot of people. A lot of people. And I genuinely don't care what your thoughts are on his politics or his philosophy or anything. The only response is tragic and sad.

Yeah. No, I mean—

But so many people felt the need to add qualifiers. Look, plenty of people felt no need Oh, yeah. To say anything that it's tragic or sad. I literally have seen just horrible women cackling online in glee.

I have too.

About this. And those are horrible demonic people.

Well, yeah, because I mean, just take things away. This was a person.

Yeah.

He was a person. And I don't care who you are, no person deserves to be like just shot like that.

No.

I mean, the guy is, the guy's just out there doing what everybody expected him to do that day, including his wife and his kids.

That it happened in front of.

Who were right there.

Yeah.

Like, this was senseless and ridiculous, uncalled for. There's no word that you can put on it other than tragic and sad because you cannot look at this in any way and go, this was anything other than that. And people are calling it a victory.

Yeah. I mean, not only that, man, like we now know that there are soft hit lists that are being produced as well as soft threats made against individuals who aligned themselves with people like Charlie Kirk.

Yep.

Which I do hope that the FBI is paying attention to these things, but it's almost impossible to see everything that happens out there on every Discord server and Reddit.

Text messages.

You can't.

No.

But there's a lot of, man, there's a lot of weirdness around this. There's a lot of people that think, because they have the suspect in custody that they believe did this.

Yes.

I'm not saying that I don't think that he did it, but I'm hearing a lot and seeing a lot of evidence that suggests that he was not operating alone.

Sure. Well, really early I went, this has to have been coordinated. And I don't know what that means because who knows, it could run way deeper than you and I think. But it really feels like he was, whether it was coerced or whether it was paid or whether it was whatever.

Right.

He didn't on his own accord choose to wake up that morning and do something that he wasn't gonna tell anybody about. It's what it feels like.

So here's a couple of things that I've heard about this that just raise my suspicious eyebrow.

One— Which one is that, by the way?

The suspicious eyebrow? It's really both of them.

Okay.

I always operate in suspicion. One, the gun was wrapped in a towel.

Right.

Have you heard about this?

I have.

Okay.

But go ahead.

I mean, the reason that you do that, That's not like a rookie move. That's somebody that's been trained as to how to keep their gun in sight. Because you keep a towel around the gun that has a scope on it so that it doesn't come out of zero. That's not just something that you figure out. 2, they released the text message conversation between the young man and his, I guess it's his boyfriend that he was living with.

Trans boyfriend.

Free person. But like, anyway, that has, I mean, honestly, that has nothing to do with it. They released the text message conversation and how they got that, who knows?

Well, they, the, the, well, the boy, the, the boyfriend gave it to them.

Well, that's what we're being told.

That's what we're being told.

So on the Patrick Bet-David podcast, they took that transcript and they fed it through AI. And AI came back and said, this doesn't seem like a real text message conversation. This seems like a script.

Interesting.

And in that script was one of the questions that the boyfriend slash roommate asks him just randomly out of the blue. How long have you been planning this?

Yeah. And he said—

And he answers the question.

Yeah, he does. About a week.

Yeah, a couple of weeks.

About a week, week and a half, something like that.

And what somebody I was listening to pointed out was like, That's because whoever wrote the script wanted them to express their intent. Because that's one of the markers that you need in order for a conviction, is to express and have evidence for intent.

That he'd been planning it. Yeah.

It wasn't just a—

Woke up one day and made it.

A crime of passion. Right, right, right. So show planning. So you have that. Um, and then you also have the fact that it was a 200-yard shot.

Yeah.

Um, which, not a ridiculously difficult shot.

No, that's actually— I mean, you can easily shoot some of these guns 1,000 yards without blinking.

But not—

oh, it— I—

the—

if I got—

You can't pick up the rifle last week and do this.

If I get— yeah, if I get some person who's never really shot before and go, hey, go give me a 200-yard shot. Yeah, not hitting him. Probably.

Probably not.

No.

So then you also have the old man in the audience that immediately confesses and starts screaming, shoot me, shoot me, shoot me.

Right.

Which gives some sort of indication of coordination.

Sure.

To what degree, I don't know.

Yeah.

It just makes everything seem very suspicious.

It does. Yeah. Um, and he's not saying anything. No, I mean, he, he is, he's deadpan. When, whenever they were reading, it's weird. It's weird the way they do things in Utah. And maybe it's more common than I realized, but when they were reading the indictment, he was just on Zoom basically.

Yeah.

Like he was on camera and they've got him there in like a suicide watch outfit. Um, and, and he's just like, Yeah. Completely deadpan.

Well, I know they're charging him with something. I don't remember what it was, but—

Oh, I don't either. Um, I mean, they're—

yeah, I mean, they've already arranged as much as they can right now. Both of them. Yeah. Um, and like, they expressed their intent to seek the death penalty by firing squad.

Well, but here's the deal. No, let me, let me take that back. Firing squad is legal in Utah.

Uh-huh.

But my understanding is it is an option available if requested.

Interesting.

So contrast that with Idaho, who also has firing squad available. Uh, they have made, uh, strides in order to make that the primary—

Oh, really?

Form of death penalty.

Interesting.

And Utah seems like that is an option that the person who is on death row can choose.

Hmm.

But again, I'm not an expert. I'm, I'm hearing what I'm hearing and I'm learning what I'm learning. Yeah. That's what I'm learning.

That's weird.

Yeah.

I mean, it's not, I mean, like, I don't know which one I would choose, honestly.

I don't either. Well, I mean, if it's lethal injection, I mean, that's like, you kind of want to know like how good of a shot are you? Well, yeah, no doubt.

No doubt.

But like, I, you know, lethal injections just, I mean, I, I hate to say it this way, but I did that to my dog.

Yeah.

Not too long ago. They literally just go to sleep, go to sleep, and then once you're asleep, they stop your heart. Yeah.

I mean, that's it.

It's, I mean, it's really completely painless and, and doesn't, it's very humane. I'll put it that way.

Yeah. But I, I mean, like that, that, that seems like the opposite effect for what we want with the death penalty. Like, it's supposed to be a deterrent.

Right. That will— that will— if you go back to— well, which, by the way, hanging is still on the ballot with some of these states.

Yeah.

Still available. But that was— now, I know that they didn't have the electric chair. They didn't have lethal injection back in the, you know, call it the 1800s, 1700s, 1600s, whenever. But they wanted to make a mockery of your crime. At that point to deter other people from doing it. And, uh, you know, we, we've kind of gone away from that. Now, listen, I'm not advocating for the death penalty or not the death penalty. I'm just saying it exists. And with it existing, these are where— this is where we're at.

I'm just perfectly fine with advocating for the death penalty on certain crimes. Um, I have no problem with it. I mean, like, there's just, there's just some crimes that are so heinous. Well, there's no, there's no reason to not have it on the table.

Well, I, I'm— I would absolutely agree with you, by the way. Um, and we could get deep into a rabbit hole.

I'm not even talking about this particular case. I'm just saying, like, sure, sure.

In general.

Um, one, because, like, I'm not convinced that this guy was, like, a lone actor.

No, I'm not either.

I really, I really like this. Again, all of the weirdness around the Trump shooting Like that kid just got disappeared.

Oh yeah.

Like we know, we know nothing about that kid. I mean, unbelievable. I mean, his whole house was cleaned out.

Yeah.

I mean, it's so bizarre.

Yeah.

The whole situation is bizarre. And now we have this and like, like there's just too many, like I heard somebody say like this, this kid could end up being like the Oswald of our day.

Interesting.

You know, he's not wrong.

Yeah.

I mean, like it's, it's a weird, I mean, not only that, man, Like, you look at Bobby Kennedy right now. Have you ever heard him talk about his dad's assassination?

I have, actually.

He believes that the man that is still currently in prison for his father's assassination is innocent.

Yeah. Right? He does, yeah.

It's a crazy set of circumstances. He 100% believes that that man was there the day that his father died. He just doesn't believe that he's the one that shot his dad.

Right.

And like, it's so like, this is not outside the realm of like unreasonable.

Sure.

Um, to, to be having the conversation of like, what the hell happened?

Yeah.

And why did it happen?

That, that to me, that's, that's one of those things where I look at this and I go, okay, I, I look at the circumstances as they are. Mm-hmm. And the situation is that Charlie was going around having conversations.

Yeah.

And we like what he said, don't like what he said, doesn't really matter. It's, it's legal for him to do what he was doing.

Yeah.

And there were a lot of people that were influenced by it.

Right. But like, okay, let's just take off the table whether or not you think he's right or wrong.

Sure.

Let's just look at the numbers.

Okay.

Okay? He was going around to college campuses.

Yep.

Okay? Having conversations with people about political issues. Not always political issues. Sometimes it was religious issues. Sometimes it's social issues. Sometimes cultural issues. But he was just willing to have the conversation.

Yeah.

Um, here's the, here's the numbers. Best case scenario on a college campus, professors in a university, what do you think the ratio is on political affiliation?

Uh, it is super high Democrat, right? Or liberal, however you want to look at it. Left-leaning.

Left-leaning.

Yeah.

And best case scenario, it's 8 liberal professors to every 1 conservative. professors. Normal is 15 to 1.

Okay.

Okay? So he's coming into a campus and offering a different perspective. The whole point of a liberal education, which is what most universities and colleges are supposed to be offering, is a balanced perspective.

Right.

That you have a place where you can come and have discourse and dialogue and actually debate and learn about the issues.

Right.

How are you gonna learn anything when you don't have anybody, statistically speaking, that represents the other perspective?

Right, in fact, so much so that a lot of these people have said, I can't state my beliefs because of fear of failing my class.

Yep.

And if that's true—

I mean, it's obviously true because they feel that way.

Sure.

I mean, I'm not saying— Perspective is reality. It doesn't make, yeah, yeah. Perspective is reality on this.

Yeah. And so if saying that's true means that something isn't what it is originally— the original purpose was supposed to be. So Charlie has come in at this point and said, I'm gonna have these conversations, give these kids a voice, help them see that they're not alone in their thinking.

And what, and what's so interesting about, I mean, I don't know how much of his stuff that you've watched or some of the other guys that come and do college debates. Quite a bit. Like, you rarely see the professors actually come out and engage them. It does happen occasionally.

It's primarily students.

Primarily students.

Primarily students.

But like, how many, it's always interesting. Some of them are always like looking at their phone, reading from their phone.

Oh yeah.

And I'm always wondering like, how many of them are like minions that have been sent by their professor with these, you know what I mean?

I do.

I don't wanna go fight him myself. I'll send you and here's what you need to say to him. And when it doesn't work, come back to me and I'll tell you why you did it wrong.

Right.

And it's like, that's just so, bugs me so much.

Well, that becomes less than debate.

Yes.

Is what that is.

Yeah.

is what Charlie did so well. You know, one of the things that is— I, I, one of the things that I appreciated about him as a person was his ability to retain information, dude, and recall it in a way that he could then articulate it to the people he was talking to.

That's the crazy part, man. I mean, I mean, like, there's lots of people that can recall information, but whether whether or not they can communicate it clearly.

That's completely— that is, to me, yes, if you can store a lot of information in your, you know, Rolodex in your brain, awesome, great. Most of those people can't walk into a restaurant and order a meal. Oh, you know what I mean? Like, they're, they're socially questionable.

Sure.

Now, I'm overstating, I realize, but His ability to, to be able to call that information.

Right.

And, and then say what he's trying to say in a way that is making sense to people. It's unprecedented, the, his ability to do that.

Yeah.

And so what I, what I am sad about as much as everything else, I'm sad that we lost a genius.

He really was, man.

Yeah.

I mean, like, look, again, Whether or not you agreed with his positions or not, yeah, that does make a difference. Dude was a communicative genius.

Yeah, he was.

And just like, yeah, you're absolutely right. I mean, his ability to recall information and study the issues and then give them back to you in a way that was palatable and understandable. And not only that, just respectful.

Well, I think so. I will say this, and I don't know, I mean, you may have some other things you want to say about it, but one of the things that I just find so bizarre about what has happened, and this is not the first time that someone's been assassinated or killed where the thing that they were trying to do, which was shut up the the person did the exact opposite.

Yeah.

Because people that never knew who Charlie Kirk was now know everything.

Oh, his name's on their lips.

They're all over the place.

Yep.

The things that he, that people had not seen from him before are now everywhere. You cannot scroll through social media without finding reels of what, you know, of his, you know, interactions with, with people while he's on these campuses, while he's talking with Ben Shapiro, talking with whomever he's talking with. And it did the very opposite. It made him louder. And it's weird to say that, but I think that—

It's the Obi-Wan Kenobi effect, man. Strike me down and you'll make me more powerful than I ever was before. And like, I mean, like, I don't mean that as like a joke. I mean, I think that's a trope in the story that George Lucas was trying to access, is that people that you try and kill Yep. Actually become more powerful.

Yeah.

Because they, when, when they actually stood for something.

Yep.

People were like, that makes them more memorable. That makes them more powerful. It makes them have like more credence to their message.

Yeah. Which I, okay. You know, not to start getting religious at all, but you, you, you look at a guy like Jesus and this very same thing happened. Sure. Right. They tried to shut him up. And not only did he, did he accomplish all of the prophecy and do what he came here to do, right? He also became louder forever.

Well, and all of his followers.

That's, that's right. I mean, you don't—

you don't— They, they stepped in line and were willing to make the ultimate sacrifice.

They did. Most of them did.

Most of them did. And because of that, we all know their names. Yep.

And they're household names.

And, and I think that most of your children who are male are named after them.

Yeah, you're right. You're exactly right. And so I just, I look at this situation and, and I go, man, like, I, I wish people would just think before they make choices, you know? Because if you would—

You're asking way too much.

I guess so. If you would think before you make choices, then you might go, look, if I do this, It's not going to accomplish the thing that I think it's gonna accomplish.

Yeah.

Even if I'm willing to be a martyr, like, for my people, whatever that means. Yeah. I, you know, I'll, I'll, I'll take the hit for everybody else. It didn't work, man.

Yeah. Which, which is interesting about this whole situation, man, is like, we're not in an election year.

No.

No.

Like, we're, we're far from it.

That's the thing is like, it's like, it's so bizarre.

Yeah.

Again, like why I lean into like, okay, like what was actually going on?

Yeah. I mean, I mean, the kid lived in St. George or was from St. George. So he's in Utah. He's, you know, he's going to a Utah school. You know, convenience was part of the equation, whether or not he was coerced or not. Convenience was part of the equation.

I mean, there's a, there's a lot of people out there with, more speculative minds than me that are already circling the drain on this one. So yeah, you can find them if you want to. But like, I mean, again, I circle back around to tragic and sad. Yeah, it is. I mean, that's really all you need to know about this. It's just tragic and sad.

I agree.

And I really hope that we can get to a better place where no one is fearful of expressing themselves in public so that they might be shot.

I mean, why are we even having to say that?

Which, okay, here's the thing. You know what I mean? This one actually really pissed me off is Destiny. I think his name's like Steven or something like that. It's just human garbage, man. Yeah. I mean, look, I believe that everyone has value, but at some point in time, it's just like, what? What is wrong with you, man? He, he was on a show and refused and in fact doubled down on his statements where he said, this is actually a good thing because conservatives need to be afraid in public. He goes, and if they're, if they're more afraid in public, they're more likely to tell Trump to turn the temperature down. I'm paraphrasing.

Sure.

Because I don't have the exact script in front of me. But he was essentially saying conservatives in public need to be afraid because they elected the wrong dude. And if they hadn't elected this guy, Charlie would've never died. And it's like, no, no, nope, sorry, man. That's not how this works. No, that dude made a choice. Somebody made a choice in order for this guy to die. And no one needs to be afraid to be in public ever, ever.

No, I agree. And did you, and did you wanna bring up the late night stuff?

Oh, 100%, man. Because I mean, like, one, I mean, like, Jimmy, Jimmy Kimmel got fired, right? Um, I mean, like, that's not what they said, but that's essentially what happened.

They removed his show.

They removed his show.

Yeah, he got fired.

So, and there's, man, as soon as it happened, this was an interesting one today, man. I saw some folks that I respect and that I love that were online saying, well, okay, fine, I'm canceling my Disney+ subscription. For those of you who don't know, like, Disney owns ABC.

Right. And ABC is where Jimmy Kimmel's show is. Right.

Um, and they're like, fine, like, if you're gonna— if you're gonna infringe on Jimmy Kimmel's First Amendment rights, free speech rights, if you're gonna— if you're gonna infringe on his free speech rights, Um, then, then I'm done. I'm canceling my subscription. I heard some other people say like, well, like, what's— what the hell with this Jimmy Kimmel stuff? We're just— we're, we're living— what, what's the— I can't even think of it. What's the political affiliation where they, they always accuse the right of being?

Oh, um, oh, you're gonna put me on the spot. I know exactly what you're talking about. Yeah. Libertarian. No, that's not the one. I'm—

it's like the negative connotation of the right.

Yep.

Because everyone on the right calls people on the left commies, socialists and communists. Um, I can't think of it anyway. Um, people were saying like, well, now we, now we live in this kind of a state where free speech is just completely gone.

Well, first of all, uh, you work for, uh, company, and, and you don't have free speech in that moment. You can have— you can go there because right, wrong, or indifferent, like, you don't just get to say whatever you want to.

No.

For whenever you are on, you are representing a company at that point, right? You don't get to say whatever you want to.

No.

So the free speech thing to me is a weird argument. in that moment.

Wait, so, like, this is the one. I mean, let me pull this up real quick because I have some manuscripts of, like, what he actually said.

Well, yeah. I mean, he, first of all, he started off calling and saying, you know, name-calling the MAGA gang. Right.

Yep.

He, he, he said the MAGA gang is trying to spin this As if the person that did this wasn't one of their own, right? That's basically what he said. Yeah, I would love to hear.

He said we hit some new lows over the weekend with the MAGA gang desperately trying to characterize this kid who murdered Charlie Kirk as anything other than one of them and doing everything they can to score political points from it. Let's see.

Well, then then he started showing something about Trump.

Trump's response to it.

Right.

And he was saying, this is not how an adult grieves the murder of someone he calls a friend. This is how a 4-year-old mourns a goldfish.

Yeah.

That was part of his monologue.

Yeah.

And again, like, am I offended by it? No.

Right.

Because that's exactly what I expect from this guy.

Sure.

That being said, ABC Disney has every right to cancel whatever they want anytime. At any time.

Because you know why? They own a company.

Yeah.

And they can do with it what they want.

And here's, here's my example to, to folks is, like, I'm not saying that Kimmel's statements were as egregious. I'm, I'm going to the extreme in order to make the example.

Okay.

But if you had an employee who was out taking care of customers in the field and was heard making and stating racial slurs about people that were not of his race, Sure. you would probably fire that individual on the spot.

I would think so.

Because you do not want your company being represented by such an individual.

It's a reflection.

Are you, squelching or squashing their First Amendment rights? No. They have the right to say those things without going to jail.

Sure.

They can say those things without going to jail. That doesn't mean that they have the right to represent you in the public.

Right. Wearing your brand.

Wearing your brand.

Like doing your thing.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And that seems to be the disconnect that so many people have is I see so many people, and like, this has become a thing now, is people crying about being fired because they made public statements about either Charlie Kirk or whatever. You know, and people are kind of done with it. They're done with people making public statements while representing their brands and their businesses, and they don't want to be associated with that anymore.

It's happening.

I don't blame them.

No. I mean, it's happening around colleges. Colleges are removing people from their student body. They've removed professors. There have been teachers that have been let go because, again, you can say what you want to as long as you're not doing it under my brand, whatever that brand is.

Yeah. And so There, there's a lot of people with this late night show stuff that are talking about Jimmy Kimmel. They're like, oh, well, the FCC. So this is government, you know, imposing their will over a media company. Here's what I need people to understand. And I'm, I'm not saying this is the entire equation, but as a business owner, you're a business owner. Let me, let me express some numbers to you.

Okay.

So Stephen Colbert.

Mm-hmm.

A few weeks ago, we heard that his show's being dropped.

Right.

Why? Is he not good?

Oh, no.

I mean, he, he's obviously a talented comedian.

He's clearly good.

Right. Since 2020, on average, his show has been in the red over $40 million annually.

Okay.

You, you, but hang on.

Okay.

Hang on. Now, this is just based off things that we know.

Right.

There's a lot of things that we don't know.

Yeah.

Because P&Ls tend to be—

Sure.

Private.

Yep.

But we have some information that allows us to see sort of through the veil thinly. Okay. Okay. Stephen Colbert was not the lowest, or wasn't the biggest loser.

Okay.

In the late night sphere.

Okay.

Stephen Colbert was number 3.

Oh, really?

Yeah. So number 2 was actually Seth Meyers.

Oh, well, okay.

The, the most successful of all the late night talk shows? Jimmy Fallon.

Sure. Not shocking.

The least successful late night show of all of them? Jimmy Kimmel.

Okay. Right?

And this has been a trend that's been happening since 2020. They said, and, and so I, I plugged everything into, into AI, and I said, give me, give me the, all the data that you can on the profitability of late night shows? Because I actually was like, oh, like you don't respond that quickly unless you were probably already thinking about doing this anyway.

Sure.

And on the tail end of them already canceling the other one.

Right.

Like what, what are the numbers? Well, they, the numbers came back and it said, well, since 2018, at best, at best, they were breaking even. And since 2018, it's been a steady decline.

Oh, man.

Meaning in 2020, Jimmy Kimmel was down 2 million. 2021, down 5 million. 2022, down 8 million.

Oh my goodness.

2023, down 10 million. Down— 2024, down 15 million. We're now in 2025.

Yeah.

What's the trend? 20 million.

Oh my goodness. So what that says is people are less interested in him as a Is it as a host?

Less interested in him as a host, but like also losing $20 million annually.

That's a bad business move. Right?

Right? At best. At best losing $20 million annually for the network. Oh my goodness. And has been trending down. Down.

You think, you think he had like this, this conversation with the higher-ups at some point and they were like, look, man, like, at this point we need you to understand that if you don't get things righted, you're going—

No, I, I think, I think he was operating underneath the idea that this is an institution that will never go away.

Especially, and, and it's, and it's Disney, right?

Yeah.

They're, they're loaded.

They can handle it.

They're loaded. They can handle it. And if anything, they're left-leaning.

Well, I mean, that's kind of the thing, right?

Right.

Is it wasn't just the FCC.

Right.

There were— what was it? Oh my gosh. I'm gonna have to look this up. Hang on. Okay. Okay. So one of the other things is you saw starting in, like, 2022, they're making a bigger push to put more of their content on YouTube so that they could try and recover some of their losses from ad revenue.

Interesting.

Because their, their ad revenue from 2018 to 2025 dropped by almost 50%. So, I mean, like, what that means is, like, interested, interested people.

Your viewership is going down.

Well, it's not necessarily your viewership is going down. It's that the people who are willing to advertise on your show Are willing to pay 50% compared to what they were willing to pay five years ago.

Gotcha. Also bad. It's a trend.

Very bad.

Yeah, this is a trend.

Hang on. I need to go back up to the top of this. Let's see here. Ba da da da. Yeah. So in in in 2018, their ad revenue was around 439 million.

Oh my goodness.

And in 2024, it was around $221 million.

That's half.

I mean, it's, that's half. Right.

And, and again, for any business, that's a bad business move. Doesn't matter who you are.

Yeah. It's like, like this thing is bleeding.

Right. Just kill it. And, and we can, anybody can look at that and go, oh, it's so much money still. Um, well, it is if you have no idea what it takes to run anything.

Yeah.

You know, I mean, it's like, it's like you, any business can tell you what their gross profits were. And I don't care. Tell me what your net profit was. Tell me what you're doing with what you've actually got. But if your overhead, you know, exceeds or is anywhere near what you're bringing in, you are not profitable.

Yeah.

So you have to, you, you have to understand, like, yes, $220-some-odd million is a lot of money.

Yeah.

But do you know how much it takes to, to do anything that they do? I don't.

No.

So I—

Well, like, I mean, like, here's the—

here's the thing.

And if you had $4 million before? Think about this. In, in 2018 versus 2025, which is the 2 numbers that we're comparing, did salaries go up or did salaries go down?

Right.

Well, did costs of production go up or did costs of productions go down? And so it's not just an option to look at like, okay, so we have half the advertising dollars that we had versus 2018. It's like our costs of producing the show have probably doubled, but we've lost half of our revenue. So we're actually down by about 100%.

It's really bad.

It's really bad. It's really bad. Really, really bad. And so, like, here's the thing is, were his comments, like, egregious and completely offensive? No.

Yeah, right.

Like, maybe not.

And expected, honestly.

Considering the circumstances, yeah, probably inappropriate.

Well, yeah.

But were they probably talking about doing this anyway? Yeah. 100%.

Yeah.

100%. Sure.

Yeah, I agree.

Like, and it's like, stop crying.

Right.

Like, you, like, one, you made a stupid decision at a stupid time that made it way easier for them to do the thing that they wanted to do, that they were going to do by the end of the year anyway. Yeah. Because they're going to stop the bleeding.

Right. And most likely the only reason that they haven't done it is because they're going, Okay, who are we gonna put into this?

No, it's because— it's because late night has been an institution in America for a long time.

Sure, but, but it doesn't mean that they can't continue doing a late night show. They just gotta find someone who can be profitable doing it.

I don't, I don't think they can. I don't think they can.

You don't think anybody exists that can do it?

No.

I mean, there, there has to be.

Not to make it profitable.

Maybe not, but I mean, you got guys out there like Jimmy Fallon making it happen, but he—

no, he's losing money too.

Oh, is he?

Yeah.

Okay.

There's not one of them that's making money.

Do you think this has everything to do with the way cable is going?

Okay, let me put it to you this way. Um, uh, what's, what's the Royal Kingdom?

I don't know what that is.

It's a, it's a game for your cell phone.

Okay. All right.

Jimmy Fallon is one of the big spokespersons for that game.

Okay.

It's a game for your cell phone, right? How much money do you think he's making from that?

I bet it's a bunch, right? I bet— I, I don't know, but I bet it's a bunch.

Could you have ever conceived of David Letterman doing an ad for a cell phone game?

No.

Why?

Uh, well, number one, he probably didn't have to.

Why?

Why? Well, because he was really good, first of all, and everybody— but here's the other thing. But here's the other thing. I also believe that we are in just a completely different culture of TV. Right.

He— David Letterman was making money.

Yeah.

He didn't have to go do anything.

Right. But, but, you know, you look at the— where we live in our culture today, everything is streaming. Mhmm. Everything is available at any time that I really want it to be available. There is, like, cable TV doesn't, it exists, but it doesn't really exist. And, like, even, like, Dish and DirecTV, like, they exist, but they really exist.

I, I really wanna hear from the people that actually have cable.

Right.

Who are you? Right.

And because, well, and here's the reason that people don't is because those contracts don't work anymore. I mean, whenever you have cable and you no longer have NBC because NBC won't do the contract that you want them to do, so now your cable company just doesn't have NBC, right? Or they don't have ABC, or they don't have Fox, or whatever. And it's like, look, I want to watch football. I don't even care about all this other, you know, whatever. I just want to watch football. I can't watch football, so what am I going to do? I'm gonna go buy, like, YouTube TV.

Right.

Or Fubo or whatever it is. Fubo? Is that a—

That's a thing. OK.

Yeah. OK. All of a sudden, I got, uh, the, uh, the old-school brand in my brain.

Yeah. I know what you're talking about.

OK. Anyway, so, like, you wind up cutting the cord and doing these streaming services, and I think that late night goes away because you know what people are doing late night? They're scrolling on their phone. They're playing this Royal Kingdom. They're watching something on Netflix. They are doing— Completely different things than 10 and 11 o'clock, you know, 12 o'clock. Yeah. Late night shows.

Late night TV is, I mean, like late night television talk shows are just irrelevant.

They are.

Well, and you, you, the, the same, the same way that news like CNN, MSNBC, Fox News, I mean, they're, they're going to be irrelevant.

Yeah.

With, I mean, like, look, we've been talking about it for years. It's like, oh, you guys don't see it coming? You, you really don't see it coming? You don't see it coming.

Mm-hmm.

Like, you're gonna be irrelevant. Like, you're going out of business. Yeah. Unless you change. They won't change.

Well, I mean, you even see, like, the, you know, the NFL playing on Apple TV.

Mhmm.

You see, you see, you know, these, yeah, these, these things that are staples are finding alternatives. Yeah.

The, the only thing keeping people in cable right now is if they're sports fanatics.

Oh, absolutely.

Which I, I have my own opinions about that, but, like, it's—

But they, but you're not wrong. I mean, it's just we live in a different culture where the, the, the institution of late night talk show is like, honestly, I, I wonder how many people actually heard him say that live.

That would be an interesting question.

Because most people heard it after the fact.

Yeah.

In a news something that they got from somewhere else and from Facebook or from Instagram or wherever. not because they heard it and were incredulous and woke up the next morning and went, oh, look, the thing that I was incredulous about, they did something about. You know what I mean?

Yeah.

So I— anyway, it, it— but this also goes back to something that I think is a fundamental truth that you and I hold, um, which is you should do good things for the right reasons.

Yeah.

Be a good person because you should be a good person. And I'll tell you right now, good people don't say horrible things about other people. So stop saying trash about other people. And could we please just act like humans and adults and like be kind to one another?

That—

I, I don't know why this is such a difficult social construct to figure out.

Right.

Like, and if you can't be kind to someone, I mean, there was an old adage, right? Can't say something nice, don't say something— don't say anything at all, right? Like, where did that come from? Well, it came from somewhere that is really good, and we've gotten away from it. And social media has perpetuated this problem that I can say whatever I want to without any recourse.

Right.

I can do whatever I want to because I can, you know, put it out there. What are they gonna do, like, digitally punch me in the face? Oh, thanks.

Yeah. You know, real quick, I wanted to circle back around. I did look it up. Um, so a lot of people were complaining that it was government overreach from the FCC, uh, putting— tightening the screws on ABC.

Okay.

About getting rid of Jimmy Kimmel. In context, here's the other thing you need to understand is you had 2 other major players, uh, acting in this. One of them is Nexstar Media Group.

Okay.

And the other one is Sinclair Broadcast Group.

Okay.

So for context, here's their statement. Nexstar Media Group, as an owner of many ABC affiliates, objected to the comments as offensive and insensitive at a critical time in our national political discourse. It announced it would pull Jimmy Kimmel Live on its ABC stations for the foreseeable future. So that was just them across the board.

So they're going, look, we, we have affiliates you won't any longer be affiliated.

Yeah. We're gonna—

with us.

We're like, you can, you can play everything else.

But not that.

But we're playing— we're pulling Jimmy Kimmel.

Yeah.