Picking Paint Colors With Farah Fornier

This is episode number 210 of The Homeowner Show. Whether you're DIY or looking to hire, we're here to help you find the best information and options for you and your home. My name is Kevin Hackett, and here with me is Craig Williams.

Hello, hello, hello, and welcome to The Homeowner Show. We're so glad you could join us for another episode live in The Homeowner Show studios. We did it again.

Who's—

oh, wait, wait, wait, where is it?

Oh, everybody is echoing. Hello, hello, hello, everybody. There it is.

We found, we found the gremlin. Ah, everything is well.

It is.

Oh, everybody, the gremlin distracted me.

We are, we are off the rails already. Why not?

Why not? It's just going to be that kind of a show.

Of course it is. Yeah, aren't they all?

Yeah, you get what you pay for, people.

Yeah, exactly.

Which is free.

I still, I I still hear it.

Why do you hear it?

It's in my ears. I don't know. Oh, it's gone now. It's gone now. We're good. Hello everyone. We are—

do you hear it?

I hear it.

Why is it in our ears?

You still hear it? Echo.

That's why.

Oh, what were you doing?

It was the Bluetooth.

Uh, Dad, you know what? I was—

yours is off.

I was talking about the Bluetooth to my dad earlier. Both of us had Bluetooth issues. This is the day of Bluetooth crap.

Well, let's just send it where it belongs.

Yes, I agree.

So this episode is off to a great start.

Oh, man.

It's one for the books. Why not?

Why not? Why not? Exactly.

So should I just walk out and then come back in?

We probably all should.

Maybe I need to get the marker boards out for the—

Yeah, I think— well, yeah, let's start over.

Send out a sign of distress to the peoples.

Absolutely.

Help.

That would be a good idea.

Well, to make at least I hit record.

Oh, you did?

So we didn't we didn't miss any of this gloriousness.

Well, it's better than you did the last three episodes.

That's right.

Oh man, I will tell you how it's gonna get worse though. Okay. Are you ready?

I'm ready.

Well, starting tomorrow, I'm gonna have naked face Kevin. Oh really? Yeah.

It's football season.

It's football season. First Game of the Season is tomorrow, so. Okay, so it's, it's, it's coming.

So you're gonna have like a reverse skunk stripe on your face.

Yeah, it's gonna be really awful, y'all.

I, I am so looking forward to it.

I will tell you, like, so I did, I did have it like down to here, and then when I left to go to Honduras, um, I was like, I don't want to deal with this in Honduras.

And so I, I cut it back because it's red and they wouldn't like you.

No, because I, I just Yeah, I just didn't want to.

Okay.

So more than anything was the mustache, because the mustache was like— Yeah, it was handled. Yeah, it was out there. And so I just didn't want to deal with like humidity and anyway, whatever. So I, I brought it down to this and it's going away.

It was a gradual reduction.

It was. Yeah, well, it was a pretty steep reduction, but it's gonna be completely bald. Which I will tell you is my wife's least favorite Kevin. Because, because now I'm— it is really bad because it's completely bald at that point.

Yeah.

I have no hair on my head.

So maybe you need like a billiard table in the house to take the distraction away from you.

I would love one. I'll just have to come to your house.

That's right. Yeah.

Because we don't have a place for a billiard table.

So anyway, we actually haven't used it all that much since we moved it in here.

I haven't.

So we did it in the party barn.

I mean, it's right here. It's just—

yeah, it is what it is.

We're too busy making podcasts to play pool.

That's right. We have a job to do.

That's right.

We're professionals.

So if you didn't notice, real quick, I want to let everybody know we're going to be reviewing this bad boy pretty soon.

Yeah.

this Google Nest thermostat. I'm pretty pumped about it. I'm gonna see how it functions and we're gonna do a review. If you guys have already used this, 'cause I know it's been out for a while.

It has, and one of the great things about it is it's cheap.

It's cheap.

Yeah.

And I think our guest tonight, you said you had one, right?

Yes, I have one.

Okay, so you might be able to give us some insight. No spoilers though.

I won't.

Okay, so we actually have, it's always weird, I don't wanna call you my old friend because that sounds like I'm calling you old. You're not old.

She's older than you.

We've been friends for a long time.

A long time.

Isn't that weird?

Like, is this my old friend? No, but like, it's like—

but here, but in all fairness, you haven't seen her in half your life.

Correct.

At this point, more than half. So more than half for you and half your life for Craig.

Sorry.

And so, so much younger.

This is, this is my friend Farrah, and I was told that I had to say your last name With an Inspector Clouseau accent.

Yes.

We'll see. Yes. We'll see. Here we go.

Vera Fournier. That's totally wrong.

Fournier.

Yeah. Beautiful. There we go. Yeah.

Wow.

Are you are you are you familiar with Clouseau?

Yes.

Yes. Really?

No.

Is a hamburger.

No. No.

The Pink Panther movies.

Oh, okay.

Yeah, sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah. From a long time ago.

A long time ago.

Yeah.

Yeah. Okay.

But he had like a ridiculous. You gotta, you gotta adjust that right there.

Okay, thank you.

It popped up on the—

See, I didn't want the headphone hair.

Oh well, you look, you look perfect. There you go. You got it absolutely perfect.

Thank you.

Yes, perfect.

Now, now you got it.

Yeah, exactly.

So Farrah Fournier Designs, that's what we're here to talk about tonight.

Farrah Fournier Design.

Yeah.

Yes.

And are you Do you have any questions, Kev?

Well, yeah, yeah, I do. I mean, I—

Well then, hold them.

Go ahead, Craig.

So, you know, I wanted, I wanted, I wanted to give a little, little backstory because like we, we actually reconnected through a mutual friend.

Yeah.

Who, and I mean, let me know that like this was, this was something that you were getting going.

Yes.

And, and you, you know, I mean, like you already, you obviously have like incredible style.

Thank you.

And so you want to share this gift with the world.

I do.

Right. And so one of the things that stuck out to me about what you're doing is helping people actually like pick colors.

Yes.

Which I think is something that a lot of people really struggle with.

They do. I mean, the struggle is real.

Because I mean, like, you can pick out colors for like your clothes, but if you don't like them, I mean, most clothes, I mean, you can throw them away. But like, if you pick out colors for your house, you're stuck with them for a while.

Yeah. And it's an investment.

And it's an expensive investment. I mean, like—

Paint is not cheap, y'all. And because not only that, you've got The paintbrushes, the rollers, the time. It is, it is, it's a lot of work.

It is. But in terms of like, you know, renovating your house and DIY, it is one of the easiest.

Oh, for sure.

And most economical.

Yeah.

To turn things around.

Yeah, no, it absolutely is.

Yeah. And you know, I mean, like, if you don't like it, you can just cover it back up. But like, you can't—

it's one of those—

it's frustrating if you don't get the right color. It's just frustrating.

Yeah.

And like, but like, even if you like, you put it on the wall and you're like, I don't like it, but like, you still want to like sit with it for a while and be like, Do I not like it? Do I like it? I mean, like, it's—

Because then it changes too. Like, the color changes over the day, the course of the day.

And the amount of splatter your kids put on it.

There you go.

There you go. Now you got polka dot walls.

What are your kids doing?

Dude, look, I, I will literally tell you that we bought a table that is in our breakfast nook in our new house that is literally just so the kids can do their art on it.

Right.

And we don't have to un-art it.

I like that.

Un-art the table. Yes, it is just art-filled.

Every kid needs a table like that. My kids had a table like that.

Yeah, it's my dad built it. I have a hard time with it because it should not be that way.

We have that at my house too. It's called outside.

That's also a good way.

It works. So walk me through this process. How do you even I don't know. How do you start helping people pick out a color?

Well, I even have a— I even—

you want to go back further than that?

You want to go back to the beginning?

I want to go back further. Like, how did you get into this? Like, where did you learn the skill of— and it's probably not learned, it's probably inherent, but like, how did you—

she's probably not colorblind.

Yeah, probably not. How did you learn? Where did you start?

How did you—

where did we begin?

So the journey began.

Yes.

Once upon a time.

Once upon a time, we moved many, many times with my husband's job.

Okay.

So Baton Rouge, Washington, D.C., Houston, Chicago, Houston.

Wow.

So in all of those moves, I have one trip to go up to the place and find our home, right? Our forever home. So that's not a lot of time, you know, it's 2, max 3 days. You know how it is. I mean, it's hard to find a house as is and in a limited amount of time, and everybody has their own budgets. So I always got a house that had good bones, that we knew had a lot of potential, that we just felt it, we loved it. But of course they were never perfect.

Yeah.

And with 3 kids, full home renovations take, you know, a lot of time, a lot of money. So I just started seeing what we could do just by painting because it is relatively simple. Anybody can do it. And so So that's how we started. And for me, it's so much fun seeing how a space can change just by painting it.

Yeah.

It's fun. And I like to see how it's just finished with the paint. And sometimes I think, hey, we're going to change the backsplash or we're going to change the granite. And most of the time we don't even have to change that because it's just worked. So it stemmed from there. And I got a lot of experience with that. And then I saw that my friends started asking me for help. And it just kind of grew. And then with all those home renovations that we were doing, I would read a lot of paint color blog posts, and there are paint color specialists out there, and I just found it fascinating. I loved it. And I used to do graphic designing.

Okay.

So I always loved the color aspect, and I saw that not everybody enjoys paint colors, and I do.

Well, and I'll tell you, like, for me, it's not that I don't like the paint colors, it's that I walk in and I look at the wall—

It's overwhelming.

Of paint colors, and I'm like, they're all the same. They're all the same. Like, that color and that color that's next to it are the same. And the problem is then you get it to your house and it's not nearly the same.

They're not.

And so it's like, I don't even know what just happened. But I feel like I got to go back to Sherwin-Williams or wherever it is that I'm going.

I know what happened.

Okay.

Most of the time it's the undertones. That's what happened.

Yeah. And because it's like the same on the same thing, there's like 5 different shades. And I'm like, is that not the same? No, it's not. It's crazy.

But the problem is the lighting at Sherwin-Williams is completely different than the lighting in your house.

Yeah.

So even within your own home, It depends on what room you're talking about. It depends on what direction that room faces at what time of day. It just makes all the difference. So when you know all of that, it makes it a lot easier.

Why is it even harder whenever you're talking about— we live in the age of LED.

Yes.

An LED has like 5 different colors it can be. You know, you've got your daylight, your bright white, your soft white, your warm white, your whatever, blue light, I don't know. And All of a sudden, and a lot of people have— get me started. A lot of people have different bulbs in the same room that are different colors. It's like, you've got to fix that.

I don't like that. That's a big pet peeve. And I'm actually— I'm so concerned with light that every time we move into a home, one of the first things I do is change all the light bulbs in the house. My husband does not like it, but he's the one up there.

He's doing it.

That's what he says. Yeah, but he's the one that's doing it and changing all of them because it makes all the difference.

Sure.

Like fluorescent bulbs, can't stand them. And certain—

I hate fluorescent light.

Me too.

It's terrible.

Yeah.

It doesn't make anybody happy.

You feel like I'm at a hospital.

Yeah. But there are, I mean, there are different rooms, different tasks that should have different lighting.

Yeah. I think like the bathroom is a prime example. Like I prefer to have a much brighter light in the bathroom than I have in the dining room, for example.

Right. Like in the dining room and in your bedroom, you're gonna want a warm light.

Yeah.

So that's the thing, lighting and painting. colors are so intertwined together.

So, but just a minute ago you used a word that I don't really know what it means. Um, undertones.

Oh yeah.

What is that?

Undertones. So every—

That's how my wife talks to me.

Oh yeah.

In undertones.

These are different undertones. These are different.

These are happy things.

Okay. Happy, complicated things.

She doesn't watch this, so I can say that. She's never watched an episode. Okay, go ahead.

She's gonna watch this one because it's about paint colors.

Yeah, I'm sure.

I asked her once and she spoke in undertones.

I know, it's true.

But no, so like take white for instance. Unless it's pure, pure white, it's gonna have some undertones, some other colors in it. Okay, so if you— the best way to choose a color and to see what undertones the color has is to compare it with another color. So if you have a couple whites and you haven't— if you see by itself it might look just like white, but if you put it next to another one, well, one can start looking more yellow because it has yellow undertones in it. This other one could look colder, cooler. That's because it has blue undertones in it. Some even have green or pink. Oof, people hate when there's a pink

undertone that pops up, and it happens really often.

White has a lot— there's a lot of whites that have pink undertones, don't they?

There are, there are. So I personally like to stay away from whites that have pink undertones, but sometimes they are necessary. They are because—

The pink ones or the—

Sometimes the, the whites or the neutrals with some pink undertones are necessary because we're trying to do away with the late '90s Tuscan design. And some of those, most of those, you can't just pair them with a white that has a yellow undertone or a blue undertone. And sometimes the pink, it's not going to read as pink when you have it on your wall, but it's just going to go better with your fixtures.

Is that why some people like don't like a room? Because is it, is it like a, almost like a subconscious clashing of undertones that they're seeing? Yeah. Okay.

Yeah, that, I mean, that's, that's the biggest problem is people sometimes try to make colors work because they like them and they see them in magazines. But if you're not able to change absolutely everything, it's not going to work and it's going to clash. So So you have to work with the stuff that you currently have that you can't change at that moment.

Yeah, we had that issue. So we just got through painting. Our friend Aaron painted from the show. He painted our kitchen for us. We had this birch color kitchen cabinets and they were glossy, glossy birch. It was fine. And so we decided to change it. And what we did was My wife wanted color, but I warned her that an entire kitchen of color would be probably too much. And so what we did was we did our island in green. Yes, but, but the green that everybody was going with didn't work in that room. Like, whatever that green is, you know what, you know what green I'm talking about.

Obviously the green.

Everybody wants that green in their kitchen or whatever. But then we went with white for the cabinets, but you can't do white, right? It's too, too much. So we did Dover White, which is just a— it's got undertones of something else.

Yeah, it has creamy undertones.

It's beautiful. It's a beautiful—

it's a beautiful—

and they match up really, really, really well. Um, but there's so many whites.

There are, there are so many whites, and I love whites. Those excite me. All the colors get me, but I love whites.

Yeah, so it's— and the other thing, people, a lot of people are going with grays for, you know, these earthy tones, right? Grays and light browns and those types of things in rooms. And is that, is that like still happening?

Yes. So, you know, after the whole Tuscan era, which was a lot of beiges and browns and yeah and golds. Then we moved into whites, and then we went gray, hardcore gray. Yeah, grays are still in. I will always love grays, but they're more warm-toned, warm-toned gray. And if you think about it, like I always tell people, I mean, trends come and go.

Yeah.

Right? And it really doesn't matter what the trends are. I talk about them because we see them in magazines and people ask, But really, the most important thing is what do you like? What do you like in your home?

Yeah, we were actually talking about that when we did our kitchen because people were like, well, the green's kind of trendy. And I said, yeah, but I, I think I'll like that forever. And I was like, if it's trendy, then the '60s are now in the 2020s. Um, right. But like, I, I, I'm just like, but I like it and I think we'll like it forever. And that's wonderful.

And that, and that's the most important thing. Like when I tell people about picking paint colors is you have to love it. I mean, it doesn't matter what the trend is. And I will say that there are classic colors that have been around for thousands of years. So for instance, like, my favorite color palette is the one from South of France. And what is it? So like Provence, South of France colors are— have a lot of green. Okay, like olive, muted green.

Herbes de Provence, man.

Yeah, there you go. Yeah, or they have like very— but the colors are very muted, very neutral, and they're timeless. I mean, they're never gonna go out of style, and they're very connected to nature. So I think greens, I mean, we see them everywhere. It's never going to go out of style. Right now, however, if you're going to choose a green that is really bold, yeah, really bright, yes, like really avocado, lime, then I mean, you are going to run the risk that you're going to get tired of it. But if you tend to choose colors that are so close to nature, it's never going to go out of style.

Yeah, I love that.

Yeah, I mean, that, that's my take on it. I'm glad you chose green. I love green. That's my favorite color. Yeah, and green and white.

We had another issue, and that was— and my wife really hated it. I, I like it, but our, our countertops are really nice granite. And they're— but they're a brown color. And so they're not the black, they're not a white, they're brown.

Do you know what it's called?

I— yeah, brown.

Um, so specific.

But I don't know. I can show you.

Septic system.

That's what it's called. Yeah, septic brown. Um, you're gonna get me in trouble, Greg, because I was about to say something else and I'm not going to. I filtered. For the record, I filtered just now. I'm here for you.

I think I know what it was.

It's a beautiful brown. You probably didn't actually, but it doesn't matter.

You're a better person than them. That's right.

Um, but it was, it was challenging because she was like, I don't want these countertops. And I was like, we're not changing the countertops. First of all, they're very nice and there is a lot of it. We're not changing that. And so I said, we need something that will complement. And honestly, the white and the green, they work great with brown.

There you go. And, but, but here's the thing, you didn't just choose white, you chose Dover White.

You know that color.

I do know that color. That's a fantastic color and it has so much cream in it. Yeah, so that is going to go with your beautiful brown granite countertops. So we haven't changed the countertops in, in any of our kitchens that we moved to. And so like the one in Chicago, I wanted to do gray, but I ended up having to choose a gray with a green undertone. Oh, that then complemented the Santa Cecilia granite, and it works fantastic. And I actually have the same color in my current house now.

Yeah. Wow. Well, so here's, here's what's crazy is she was really concerned. She also didn't like the backsplash, and she was like, I want to change backsplash too. And I was like, we don't— we're not doing all of it. We can't do all— we gotta, we gotta make some choices here. Um, But what we didn't even realize was the backsplash has diamonds, um, you know, intermittent around it, and it is the same— it's the granite. It's— and I was like, this is a problem. But now that we did the colors that we did, she actually likes the backsplash.

See, I love that. That's the best. And you, and you were able to have your kitchen remodeled with just paint, right? I love that. Isn't that fun?

Well, yeah.

And your wallet, your wallet thinks it's fun too.

Yeah, I mean, we, we did pay professional to do it because your kitchen cabinets are not a wall.

Absolutely.

Way different.

It has to be sprayed.

But yeah, it was, it was a whole thing, and Aaron did an amazing job. But that being said, um, yeah, I think that there's so much that paint can do for a home to change Your lovability of a space.

Absolutely. Yeah, and it's just it's just a coat of paint.

Yeah, right. Two minimum and a primer.

And a primer. Don't forget and sanding.

Yeah.

Y'all just made it sound a lot harder than what you're talking about.

The details.

Yeah.

So okay. So here's another question. That being said, you don't do the work as far as. Painting? No, sir. Do you like to paint?

Not particularly.

Okay.

But my husband, I make him paint.

Uh-huh. Make. Yeah, I heard that.

He gets voluntold. But then, but then when I, when we say that we did the painting, I say we painted.

We painted.

The collective we.

Oh yeah.

I chose the color.

Sure.

I chose the color every time. But no, look, I have painted. I actually painted in Chicago. I painted our bathroom cabinets. I didn't want to pay somebody. They came out really, really nice.

Yeah.

You know, I'll paint the small rooms like the powder room. Yeah, stuff like that. I just don't necessarily have the patience. I like to more—

Just to let them know that you can, but that you won't.

Correct.

Can, but I won't. Yeah, he knows.

He knows.

He's aware. I'm on your side. You're from our country.

From this side of the ocean.

That's right.

That's right. So is it like a— is it a marriage thing? Or is it like a national It's like, remember Normandy? Or like, we saved your butt. Or it's not like an American French thing.

I mean, I like to bring that up.

Okay.

I like to bring that up.

I like to know that that's in the mix.

Yeah. Also, Cinco de Mayo. We're about to learn something. Okay.

So like, we here, or he is like, it's like you're telling us, like, he's got it coming.

Yeah. Well, yes.

Okay.

But so, you know, everybody here in the States— well, in Texas.

Yeah. Texas and the States are synonymous. Let's be honest.

This great state of Texas. We love to celebrate Cinco de Mayo.

We do.

So what do you guys think Cinco de Mayo is? Well, other than margaritas and fajitas, right?

Well, that's what I really thought it was, but I think that most people think it's the like the Mexican Independence Day.

It's not.

Yeah.

Okay.

It's not. So Independence Day is the 16th of September. What? 16 de septiembre. But this is the fun story. Cinco de Mayo is when the Mexicans Pushed the French.

Oh, there we go.

Out of Mexico.

Oh, even better.

I think it was in the city of Puebla. I could be wrong. My dad might correct me later. I think it was in Puebla. So I love Cinco de Mayo.

Oh, yeah, you do.

Because that is when my people shoved your husband's people out.

Out forever.

Forever. And finally.

And finally. It's about time. Yeah.

It took too long.

They needed to get out of there.

Yes, they did. So they Went to Canada and good.

Home.

They went home.

Yeah, they went home.

That was that was something else.

Okay. Those were the Acadians. Okay.

Trust me, if you watched like the last episode that were I guess it was three or four episodes ago now, you know that I do not know geography because we had all trivia about it. Yeah.

Like I will say this, like have you guys heard some of the crazy stories? about France from like the Revolutionary War and then like the Civil War. Like some of the stuff that like, like those, those guys were like crazy.

Yeah.

Like making like sneaky diplomatic moves. The Revolutionary War, I mean, like I'm convinced never would have happened without France, right?

Like, oh yeah, they were.

I mean, and then the Civil War, um, they, they were doing some sneaky stuff too. I mean, they were kind of playing both sides. Like the North and the South.

I need to catch up on that.

So the Civil War, I'm, yeah, I'm unfamiliar with that. Yeah, they were revolutionary.

Yeah, they were revolutionary, but I didn't know about the Civil War.

Yeah, they were involved for sure. Really?

Oh yeah. Well, I mean, like, we hadn't pushed them out yet.

Is that what part of it was? They were, they were hedging bets on both sides because the North was more industrial, but the South was, you know, cotton and tobacco and all that kind of stuff. And they're like, well, which one do we want? They're like, well, we want both. And so they were kind of watching and then helping and then watching and helping.

Pretty smart.

Yeah. They helped like with some like, I think it was, there's a lot of people that think that part of the reason that the South lost is because I think the French ended up, somebody's gonna, you know, fact-check me, I'm sure. If I remember right, I think they were helping blockade the Southern Navy. and, and helping them. And because like the Southern Navy ended up getting like destroyed.

Yeah.

And that was part of why they ended up losing the war was because they didn't have a naval presence. Um, and a lot of interest. And they were, um, and I think again, like I'm just having like recall this on the, on the fly. I don't know that this is completely accurate, but I think what happened was is the French were helping sneak supplies into the South because the North had a blockade going. And they were like, well, we don't like that. We want to get some Like we trade with those people, right? So it was it was a whole thing. The most I really know about French, and they had great colors on their flag.

Well, that's true. The most I know about the French people, I learned from Monty Python and the Holy Grail. Okay.

So, which is wholly accurate.

Now come back before I taunt you a second time. That's what I remember. Yeah.

You know, I think that I think that's yeah.

It's accurate.

It's accurate.

Yeah.

Yeah, we've done all the Americanized version of the French people now. We've done Clouseau and Monty Python. That's right. What else do you need to know? The only ones that really count.

That's right. That's right. So I think we're supposed to be talking about paint.

Okay.

I don't know. We can. We can.

We can.

I don't know. What's the next question? Do you have a question?

So I'm actually, I'm actually curious about the color because this, this is a problem that I have when I pick out color. Like if I go to like a big box store, like I look at the colors, I know that I like some of the colors, but I'm like, I know that these colors Like I can go over there, I can ask for this color, and I can take it home. But it's probably going to look completely different when I get it home because the light it will is different. Yeah, for sure. How do you overcome that? Like how do how do you? I mean, like is is it really that you like cost $150 per

room? Well, obviously that I mean like hour and a half consultation. But I mean like for for people that don't have access to you, like like they live in your old town Chicago or they're down in Florida or wherever.

I'm online also.

Well, okay, there we go.

You can do things online?

Absolutely.

I mean, how? Because again, the lighting.

Okay, like, how do you do that?

Well, first of all—

yeah, no, that's a great question. I'm curious as well.

No, no. Well, here, I'll just— I'll give you the steps.

Okay.

If you can't— if you can't have me over at your house.

Okay.

Or do the online consultation. So first of all, pick a color, right? If you have something in mind. So let's say you're gonna go What do you want to choose, white or green?

Okay.

Right?

Sure.

And then it would be very good to know what direction your room is facing.

So let's talk about like north, south, north, south, east, west.

So let's say that your room faces north. That is going to get the coolest light in your entire house. So a color that— let's say, let's go with white.

Okay.

That you thought looked creamy in the store, you bring it home and you put it in a north-facing room, it's going to look a lot cooler. It's going to look more gray than it did in the store. So you can go in with that. And so let's just say— let's just stick with the north. Okay, so you can go in.

So when you say north, like, you— it probably has like a north-facing window?

Correct. Okay, sorry, it's where the window— okay, where the light is coming from. Yeah, the light's coming from— if you're—

Talking about natural light.

Natural light, correct. Okay, southern gets— that's the best light, southern light. So if we ever build a home, I'm going to want like my kitchen and my living room to face south because that gets beautiful warm light all throughout the day. That's just the best.

Like your oranges and your reds and your— is that what you're talking about?

Um, so the light is warmer. Yeah, so like, do you see those light bulbs up there? They're warmer than the one over here that has more white, right, undertone, more blue.

Because it faces south.

That's why, because the light bulb is facing south at night.

I need to get— I need to orient myself.

It actually is not. That's north.

That is south.

That's south.

It's picking up the moonlight. Anyway, so yeah, and then like east, for instance, it gets warmer light, okay, in the morning, and west is going to get it in the evening. Okay, the sun rises in the east, sets in the west. Yeah, so you can go with that. So let's say we're going to stick with our northern room. We're going to go, we're going to say, okay, I need to start picking things that maybe are a little bit more warmer than they look in the store. And you're going to grab a lot. You're going to grab a lot of different whites.

Okay.

Because the best way to choose paint colors is by comparison. You can't just choose it by itself because if you're just looking at a color by itself, it's going to maybe just look white.

Right.

But when you put it next to another white, that's when you're going to see the magical sneaky undertones that we were talking about.

There's a lot of nuance between—

There is.

All of them.

Yeah, there is. There, there really is. And it's hard to see if you're just seeing it like right there by itself. So you're gonna have to compare. And so you're gonna have to compare them in your room, and then you have to go with what you're liking. That's why, that's why I tell people all the time is first just go with what you love. Yeah, go with what you love. And then after that, let's say you've narrowed it down to hopefully 2 or 3.

Just 2 or 3 different whites?

Yeah, let's say you've narrowed it down. My favorite way of doing it when I'm doing in my own house is I do like to paint cardboard, like big poster board.

Okay.

Especially if I'm doing something like cabinets, because it's an investment when you're painting cabinets versus just painting a wall, right? So you put it on the poster board and then you stick those poster boards on your wall, and then you see how they look at different times of the day because it's going to change depending on the hour of the day. So if you're using the room mostly in the morning for work, well then that's really what you're going to care about, how the paint looks at that time of day.

Yeah.

And then that's it.

So, but I mean, like, that's— I mean, I think a lot of people go, like, if you go to like a Lowe's or a Home Depot, they're like, well, I'm gonna buy like a gallon of paint. You can do that though. I mean, like, you can get like a little sample of—

You can, right? Yes, absolutely. You can get a sample, or now they have Sampleize, which is amazing.

What's that?

They have— they are— it's a company. It's really great. I might have one here to show you. It's, it's kind of like this. They have—

Oh, it's like a big block.

Well, the big block is the designer block, but you can get something like this and then you can stick it on your wall. Okay, so this is like an 8 by 8. This one actually isn't from Sampleize.

But, um, Sherwin-Williams has some of those as well. Yeah, there you go.

Okay, this is Sherwin-Williams. Okay. And this is awesome. Yeah, so you just get this and put it on your wall.

But it's not every color though. That's— they don't have every color like that, do they?

They don't. Sherwin-Williams doesn't have every color.

They just have the most popular, I guess.

But Sample Eyes probably will.

Okay.

And they have all the different paint companies. It's really, really nice.

Can you order it online?

Yeah, you can order online. It's very, very nice.

So I'm assuming then that's a website, Sampleize?

It is.

Okay, I'm gonna find it. You're gonna find it?

Okay. Yeah.

Well, because we need to link it in the show notes.

This is a good resource.

It is a very good resource. So it's really nice.

And that, that actually leads me to another good— I mean, like, when people look at colors online, like you're, you're on somebody's Instagram, you're looking at it on like Pinterest, Etsy, whatever. Like, I imagine those colors don't look the same on your screen when you get them home.

Well, and then plus, you know, everybody who's posting on Instagram, Facebook, Etsy, whatever, they have filters. I mean, they are blowing out the light. Yeah, if you see it. So it's so hard, you know, people will say, oh, I saw this color, this kitchen says that these cabinets are this color, and I look at it and I know the color and it's absolutely not that color at all. Yeah, it's way brighter, it's lighter. So no.

So once again, we learned that the truth is not on the internet.

No, it's not.

I found that out yesterday. I just had to go back to bed. I didn't know what else to do. I thought that everything on the internet was true till yesterday. So, okay, another question.

Yes.

Which paint company do you prefer?

So I love Sherwin-Williams. Yeah, I really, really like Sherwin-Williams. I think the quality of the product is fantastic. The people in the store have always been so helpful.

They're knowledgeable.

They're so knowledgeable. They're patient. They're kind. But really also the product is just superior. It is. It's a really good paint.

Yeah, even their lower grade stuff is still really, really good. But here's what's amazing, and like whenever we were there most recently, we just bought our house, so we've done some painting. And one of the things I like is, is the guy will— would say things like— I would say, well, I prefer— and this is just my own personal thing— I prefer an eggshell or a satin on an— on a regular interior wall, but like on trim, I would prefer a semi-gloss, you know. And, uh, what's interesting though is like my brother, he wants semi-gloss on his walls and he wants high gloss on his trim. And so, um, it's easier to clean. Sure. And well, so that's one of the things that he—

that the guy at the store was telling me. He's like, well, what room is this going in? And I was like, well, this is going in my daughter's room. And she— he said, well, how old is she? Well, she's 9. And, um, he said, okay, you should go with the semi-gloss because most things are going to come off of it. It's going to clean better. But this is what was really interesting to me. And this is stuff that I'd never heard before. He said if you go with this paint grade, which is a higher quality, it's more expensive, then you can go with an eggshell and still get cleanability and still get that, that sheen that you want. And if you go with this lower grade paint, it's

less expensive, but you need to go with a semi-gloss for the for the durability, you have to get that sheen in order for that to happen.

For sure.

And that was the first time I had ever heard that, and it made me— it like completely changed my understanding of paint quality and understanding the different sheens. And it's like, well, why would I go with this? I don't remember the Capture or whatever it is versus the Emerald, or the Emerald versus the whatever, you know. And I was so— he was so knowledgeable and so helpful.

They are. Yeah, no, they're, they're a wealth of knowledge. I, I love them. But yeah, so like everything in our homes is always Sherwin-Williams. And with my 3 kids, there's a lot to clean, scruffs. And I'll even do like a Magic Eraser. It's great.

Yeah.

And, um, and I have eggshell and satin finish on my walls. Even just like a sponge, warm water, it comes right off.

So the other thing that's nice about Sherwin-Williams is they keep your stuff on file.

Oh, they do. It's so nice.

And so if you ever like, like you can go to Home Depot, they're not keeping that on file, you know, Behr paint, whatever. I mean, better keep that lid. Yeah, exactly. Take a picture. Yes, just take a picture. Uh, but also take a picture before it fades because it'll— that sticker fades. So I do love the fact that Sherwin-Williams keeps your— if you'll just give them your information, they'll keep it on file. It's great.

No, they're fantastic. So I, I love Sherwin-Williams. That's primarily the colors that I work with. And I do also love, love, love Farrow Ball. Have you heard about that?

No.

Yeah.

Well, no, I said yes. The answer is no.

I just wanted to sound cool.

Yes. No, no, no. But I'm on Sampleize's website.

Yeah.

They have Farrow Ball. They have 4 companies that they're displaying here. Benjamin Moore and PPG, which is Whatever. Pittsburgh. Okay. And Sherwin-Williams, and then Farrow and Ball.

Yeah. So Farrow and Ball is absolutely fantastic. This is like the crème de la crème of paint colors. They're from England. They are very pricey, but they're very, very beautiful, and they're made with natural pigmentation, so they have minerals. So the colors just have a lot of depth to them. that you're not going to get normally with other paints. And they have a very curated list of colors, which I think is fantastic. They don't have tens of thousands of colors. It's very curated.

Like 50 shades of all the greens and the reds and whatever. It's like, here's the red, here's the— is that kind of how it is?

Yeah, they're just— they're amazing. I mean, I almost feel like you cannot go wrong with any of their colors. However, the downside— yeah, you are paying for it. Yeah, I mean, you're paying for it, but the quality of the paint is also amazing. And a lot of times you can just get away with doing one coat.

Oh wow.

So if you do the math, you know, depending on—

I mean, like, like, how much, how much am I paying? Twice as much? Am I paying 3 times as much?

I mean, it's gonna be at least twice.

At least twice?

Yeah, at least twice.

Okay.

At least. But they are some fantastic colors. I would love to have some in my home.

Gallon of paint from this company, what am I looking at?

Well, I'm not sure because I haven't priced that out anytime soon.

Is it on the website there?

Yeah, it's gonna be there. Is it? I don't know. I mean, this is just their—

Well, click on something, man.

Come on.

I did. The paint samples are all the same price.

Yeah, the paint samples.

There's not like a link back to their page?

No, no, they didn't give a free backlink.

If it's in pounds, I want you to do the conversion. No, it's not.

But I will say this, like, um, Well, for example, Aaron, he doesn't use Sherwin-Williams on, on—

I was trying to— I was thinking of that. What was the paint? Because he uses like a mineral paint.

Yeah, it's similar. It's from Italy, actually. It's another brand, and I just lost what it is. Uh, but that's what he used. He— but here's the thing, he used Sherwin-Williams colors, but he was able to get those colors in this other paint. And the paint is very durable. It cures over a matter of, I think he said, 6 weeks. Wow. And the longer and longer it gets very hard, which is great for cabinets. So I'm going to remember it, but it may not be tonight until I go home and I look. But yeah, I'm interested in this fair home. But where do you buy it?

You can buy it online.

Oh, you just buy it online?

And they just opened up a showroom in Dallas, Texas. a road trip for me.

Yeah, just 3 and a half hours, we can be there.

Yeah, absolutely. Let's just go now.

Oh, well, I mean, what part of Dallas?

Well, now we're asking a lot of questions. It's gonna be in the fancy part of Dallas.

I'm a curious man, Farrah.

Yeah, how about—

yeah, Dallas Highland Park.

Okay, I just came up with that.

It's in the Galleria area.

Yeah, sure, it might as well be true.

Yeah, but no, they did— they just opened up the showroom and I am just dying to go.

Yeah, um, Renner. Isn't it Renner?

I don't know, I was trying to look up that episode.

Yeah, I think it's Renner. Yeah, Renner paint, that's what it is.

Okay.

Yeah, it's Renner, R-E-N-N-E-R, and he swears by it for, for, for cabinets. That's what he swears by. So, um, and, and we've been really happy with it. Like, um, it's—

Oh, so you have him in your kitchen? That's what he used?

He used Renner.

Was it oil-based?

Yeah.

Or water?

No, I don't think so. I think it's water-based, which is really great.

I remember him saying that.

Yeah, which, because I was like, really? Why would you not use an oil base on cabinets? And he was like, because you don't have to.

No, you don't have to now. Like the Super Paint from Sherwin-Williams, it's fantastic. And you do have to let it cure. And so when they painted my cabinets in Chicago, they used water-based. latex paint, and the guys that were painting the cabinets took them into the garage, and it was wintertime, so it's very cold in Chicago. Yeah, a little bit different than here.

Yeah.

And they had— this is gonna sound odd— but a, um, a big tin barrel, and flames were coming out of it.

Oh yeah, yeah, I've seen that.

A flaming barrel of fire.

Yeah, I've seen this.

To help. And, and I walked in my garage. I didn't have a heads up that there was going to be a flaming barrel of fire in my garage.

Right.

But just a Tuesday there.

Yeah, it was just— and they were looking at me like, why is she freaking out?

Right?

This is fine.

There's paint fumes and just a combustible in your house. No big deal.

Paint fumes and fire. But they were— they said it was to cure it.

Yeah, that's interesting.

Oh yeah. And they were amazing. Like, the quality was great.

When were you in Chicago?

So we were there 4 years ago. 4 years is how long we've been here.

Did you ever eat at the Girl and the Goat?

Yes, we did.

Yeah.

Yes, we did. It was so tasty.

I need to tell you a crazy story about that restaurant when we're done.

Okay, absolutely. Yeah, that, that's a nice—

oh yeah, yeah, awesome.

Actually, my husband's in Chicago right now.

Is he really? Yeah, it's, it's one of my favorite food towns.

Oh, it's fantastic for food.

It's so much fun.

Well, pizza. It is, it is amazing for the pizza, but for everything else— and you can have it delivered. We have it delivered, by the way.

Oh wow. Yeah, so the whole reason we went there is because the best Mexican restaurant in the country is in Chicago.

Really?

Oh yes, yes. Um, Rick Bayless.

Rick Bayless.

Nice.

Yeah, that was the whole reason we went, was to go eat at 2 of his restaurants.

That is a very good reason.

Frontera and, um, I can't remember the other one. He's got like a street taco place that he's got right next door to it that we went to as well.

Was it worth it?

Absolutely, it's gonna be worth it.

He's the king of mole.

Oh yeah, interesting.

Mole Puebla.

Okay, that's where it originated from or what?

They have a lot of mole.

Okay, and agave. I'm being filmed.

I would just tell you every mole that you've ever had here is just like nothing. Compared to like what that man can make. Interesting. Because most people don't even like, like most people just have like the brown mole and the green mole.

Okay. Do you know where you need to go in Houston if you haven't been yet?

Where?

Hugo's.

Okay. Oh yeah, I know Hugo's.

Fantastic.

Yeah.

Well, you probably say Hugo's.

I can say Hugo's.

You can.

Yeah, I can.

I say Papacito's. So I would really like to go to this place. I went to Lupe Tortilla today.

Delicious. The best fajitas. Awesome.

So good.

Those are the best.

So good.

Hands down.

My conflict is I know how to say Hugo, but like, but I have family from Hugo.

Oh, Oklahoma.

Slightly different.

Yeah.

And well, you know what it gets me too is like when I, when I say the word humble, right? Oh yeah, we're so close to humble, and I have to double think every time I say humble and umble.

So I grew up in La Mesa, Texas.

Okay.

And, um, everybody wants to correct me and say it's La Mesa, and I'm like, no, no, I grew up there, like, I know. And it's one word, not two. And, uh, it's La Mesa. I'm sorry, it just is. But it, it's La Mesa, it's La Mesa, whatever. Names are funny.

Yeah.

And the way us Texans and Oklahomans, yeah, say things It's just what it is.

Yeah, it is. Yeah. Just like, you know, New York, they say Houston.

Oh yeah.

Do they really?

Yeah. Soho, south of Houston.

That's kind of—

was that because there's like— is there like a— it's rude.

It's rude.

It's south of Houston Street.

Oh my goodness.

That's not what that is.

No at all.

It should be. So it should be what? Sohu.

Sohu.

Sohu.

Let's just start calling it Sohu instead of Soho.

That's good. There's—

I'm gonna do that when I go there just to irritate them.

Do it. We're so cute.

It will not take much to irritate them.

Not for me.

Because you've never been to New York, have you?

What?

I was telling somebody the— so I've been— the one time I've been north of the Mason-Dixon line was to go to Chicago.

Wow.

Okay. Well, you need to go to New York.

Yes.

Do I? Absolutely. If you like food. So we took the kids on spring break again and we Made the trip, it was strictly a foodie trip.

Yeah.

And so everybody got to pick their favorite restaurants. They like to watch Food Insider.

Oh, interesting.

So yummy. So all the kids made a list and nice, we ate so much.

Yeah, we— well, you should know, I mean, Craig's a major foodie. I have tried to become more of a foodie and I really, I feel like I've, I, I've always tried to be that. Craig has really helped me with that. But yeah, he's definitely a foodie for sure.

Well, then you need to get the next plane ticket and go to New York with your family and just go eat.

By the way, that's going to be tomorrow. The next plane ticket will be tomorrow.

Yeah, you know, my wife is currently trying to talk me into a trip to DC.

Oh, we love DC.

DC, there's— and again, there's like, there's a chef there that we like, Michael Voltaggio. I think he has a place there named Volt. And apparently, like, the food scene in DC is really great as well.

Oh, it's very nice. We enjoyed it so much when we lived there.

They have pizza there too.

But like, it's kind of one of those things at this point, like, I sent my wife and daughter to New York and it was like right before COVID They had a great time. And it's one of those deals, I kind of want to be like, I haven't gone yet. And I kind of like saying that I haven't gone.

That's like people that are like, I've never seen Star Wars.

Exactly.

That's exactly how I feel about it.

It's like, I've never gone.

gone, and I'm kind of cool with it. But like, like, I know I would enjoy it.

Oh, you would.

There's nothing, there's nothing like, like, I don't want to go. It's like, just haven't gone.

Yeah, you're not getting any younger, Craig. Younger than me, apparently. He, he will always be that.

Some snot-nosed kid.

Right, exactly. No, DC's actually— I, I really, really enjoy DC. Um, And you can do DC in a couple of days or you can do DC in a week. I mean, it just really kind of depends on how you want to do it. Yeah.

If you do DC, you got to branch out in Virginia. The Blue Ridge Mountains, so beautiful.

Baltimore. There's so much.

Annapolis.

Oh, I would love to go there.

Beautiful.

Yeah, I would love to. I've not, but I would love to.

And the colors that they paint their homes in Annapolis are fantastic.

I actually, I see a lot.

Blues and That—

see, I see a lot of those colors coming into Houston now where people are actually doing—

Yeah, people, people are getting, you know, they're getting more bold. Yeah, just awesome, which is so—

Yeah, I'm kind of done with the, um, what it— stucco. Yeah, like the, the—

I like—

I don't dislike stucco. I'm just, I'm just kind of like, I'm done with like the beigey color of the house and that like, that's in spring.

That's like spring Texas. Yeah, that's all it is. Yeah, you know.

Yeah, I'm not, I'm not opposed to it, but like, it's like when every house—

You just want color.

Yeah, I want something different. Um, well, I say that and my house is brown.

Well, but then you get people that are like, I'm just gonna paint this brick, and I'm like, slap you. Yeah, although my last house is—

You can do that.

I know you can, but don't.

No, you can.

Yeah, Desiree did that to her house, didn't she?

Desiree did it.

She painted the brick.

Yeah, I've seen a lot of people do it and If it's done the right way, like you shouldn't just paint a thick coat of paint on it. That's not gonna work. But there, you know, there's different— you can like whitewash it. So, or—

It's hard to paint brick because we— the last house that we had was painted brick and it just all peeled off. Like it wasn't painted well. It wasn't primered. I was trying to see if you were the Sherwin-Williams people.

I didn't know.

It was before I bought it. It was already this way. That's a different So I have no idea. No, it was here.

Oh, it was here?

Yeah.

Oh, that one was painted.

Yeah, it was painted and it was fine until it started peeling off.

And it's not fine anymore.

That's what actually it is. That's so true. Because we can paint this house or move out.

No, but you can even paint, you can even paint rocks. So for instance, like in our stone.

Rocks.

My kid did that for a project one time.

Yeah. As did mine. As did mine. But for instance, like, the stone in our fireplace, and we have a couple columns in our homes. When we first moved in, my entire home was brown. Everything just brown when we bought the home. And then we collectively—

I heard. I heard that.

Yeah. Whitewashed the stones on the fireplace and the columns, and it came out fantastic. Yeah, I, I've actually seen some of the whitewash stuff because you can still see that the color of the stone come through, or the different tones of the color.

That's the big deal to me, is because the— there's something amazing and wonderful about brick, like the colors that are in brick. Um, except the pink brick. Going back to pink, there's a lot of pink brick, and I'm like, oh, I love that color. No, you don't. Because now your whole house is pink. But, um, it— like fireplaces, I mean, it's— there's something very warm and homey and, and inviting to a brick fireplace, right?

For sure. You—

then people will come in and they'll just paint it, a lot of them like black or like this heavy, heavy brown or a white, just a stark white. And it's just like you just lost all the— that feeling that it gave you, and now you just made it another wall in your house. Right. You know what I mean? And I don't like that, but the whitewashing—

But that's personal.

It is. And then, you know, whatever. But you can't undo it. That's my other problem is you can't undo it.

Once it's done, it's done.

Yeah. You can't sandblast it or something?

It's like painting wood trim. I guess if you really want to. Inside your house.

Inside your house, it's like, hey honey, I don't want to do this anymore.

I'm not saying you'd want to. I'm just like, if you really had to, couldn't you?

I mean, I guess. Or like with a little toothbrush. No, to not make such a mess.

It's like the one little fleck that's just right there that's going to bother me.

That one child you hate. Come here.

We all got a little job for you.

It's one of those deals.

You can clean the brick or you can get out of the house. Yeah.

Because here's the deal. At the end of the day, you have a child that you hate and a child that you love. So there you go.

Is that how it goes?

Not in my house, but everybody else. You ask. It's like, which one do you like more?

They're like, I feel like this is a problem for someone that only has 2 children. It's right.

But y'all are thinking of which one it is. Hey, y'all know.

I love them all equally.

Sure you do.

I'm being filmed.

I feel that way about other people's children.

Right? Oh, oh, I just hate all of them, to be quite honest. Uh, until they become teenagers, I'm fine with that.

Okay. So, all right, so I, I have a— what I, what I think is a, a controversial area in, in design right now. Wallpaper.

Oh, I love wallpaper.

You love wallpaper?

I do.

Okay. Because I understand, like, it's kind of making a comeback.

It is. Yeah. Because people are getting bolder with their choices.

Right.

And I think that is because of social media. And so people are now, like, we have access to all these amazing designers and architects from all over the world. And I don't know, I feel like in a lot of countries, people have been a lot more bold for quite some time now. So like England, for instance, yeah, you know, they do a lot of wallpaper, they do a lot of bold colors.

Did they ever stop?

I mean, I don't think they ever stopped.

I was gonna say, like, when I was there, it was like, I still love wallpaper.

Yeah, no, so I think wallpaper is great. And I think also what I like to do with it is maybe not necessarily— I personally am not going to do the entire room, right, ceiling to floor in wallpaper, but maybe do some wainscoting, some Paneling halfway up, and then the top half or the top 2/3 do wallpaper.

Especially on an accent wall.

Yeah, or an accent wall. Yeah, I mean, it's so much fun.

Yeah, and I've even seen a lot of people doing like textured, like heavily textured wallpaper.

Yes.

Are you seeing a lot of that?

Absolutely. No, they're very nice. And then you can also do— they have like the peel-and-stick wallpaper, which I think would be great like for kids' rooms.

Yeah, speaking of paint, um, so I—

and wallpaper—

so I, um, First house I owned, I decided that I would paint over what it was, and I realized as I started painting, and I was like, there is— this is not normal. I realized it was over wallpaper. Yeah, I realized, oh, someone had painted over wallpaper. So I was like, well, I got to fix this. So I started taking the wallpaper off, and then I realized there's more wallpaper underneath it. And yeah, I did that 4 times.

Oh my gosh.

There were 4 layers of wallpaper and it was painted on top of it. You're like 3 inches— That's what I was gonna say, I gained 3 inches in my room. So it was like—

You did.

It was crazy.

It was awful. It was really, really awful that all the coats of wallpaper were not done well. And it was just—

That's a lot of work.

It's a lot of work. And I guess that's what they thought too, just cover it up.

Just cover it up. Yeah.

How much weight was taken off your wall? Good grief.

I don't know. It's crazy. I don't— I really don't know why they did it. Well, I do know why they covered up each layer, because it was ugly.

They made 4 terrible choices.

They did. Every, every choice was worse than the one before it. And, uh, then finally paint fixed it. Um, but when— here, here's the crazy thing. When I got down to it, it was paneling underneath.

Oh, nice.

Which I actually loved.

Yeah.

Um, I, I actually really like— I like— and we did wind up painting paneling. It was really, really nice. So what color did you choose? Um, it was actually, um, it was blue, like a turquoise.

Nice.

Yeah. And then we did the, the ceiling was green. Yeah, it was a turquoise on the wall and the ceiling was green.